cop v bike - Page 2

^^Nah, I was talking about those who may feel anyone is saying it was okay to hit the bike.  As I don't think anyone has said that with any sort of certainty.
 
Yer fighting the good fight and I cna see that.  I've been the self-designated, "forum-person-who-tries-to-get-everyone-to-see-both-sides-of-the-story-when-cops-are-involved-and-not-making-sweeping-generalizations," guy for a while.  The backup is appreciated
 
There are a few of us on here, Playful included.  If it weren't for your guys' level heads I would have lost the fight long ago... not that I'm winning, either
 
I love to debate and disagree, so long as the viewpoints have some amount of reason and intelligence to it.  I would get annoyed with someone who defended cops to their deaths, no matter what too.  I've met those people before, cops can do no wrong, you don't know what they go through, kind of people.  Those people don't like me and the feeling is mutual, only I'm smarter than them, lol.
 

I work about one mile from where that accident occured.  The
South Carolina State Police are getting some tremendous heat
from all kinds of videos being released with questionable behavior.
That rider definitely didn't have mad skills. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: rtbconstrictors

RCR  ok so what would your fix be.  If a guy on a motorcycle just robbed your house, how would you like the police to stop him?  If a guy on a motorcycle passed a cop going 110 mph would you want the police to try to stop him before he runs that red light and broadsides a vehicle you are in.  What would the proper tools be?  We still don't know why this guy was running.
No matter what it is easier to second guess.  You said yourself the patrol car made several moves could, and think about it, could the cop be trying to avoid the bike but reactions made it look like he ment to hit him?
Pursuits will always have mixed emotions.  Sometimes I think that they are a necessary evil.  As I said sometimes.  Pursue over a wheelie - no, over certain speeds - no, felony crimes - violent ones and some non violent.
The motorcycle was non at a high rate of speed at the time of the accident, but how fast before?  Did the motorcycle just make a corner?  Did the motorcycle almost wreck on his own and scare the rider?  Was the rider inexperienced?  What if the motorcycle was pit-ed at 100 mph?  If you have to end a pursuit vehicle vs vehicle slow speed is key to avoid major injury, for the most part.
To me dash cams are also questionable.  What if you let a freind use your motorcycle and he not you run from the police?  The next day or two cops show up and you go to jail because you resemble the rider on your motorcycle that ran from the police who have a video that clearly shows your tag.  You say that the videp is not you but getting a good id on the rider who had a helmet and pant and long sleeves on would be hard espically because you let your friend use your helmet.  Dash cams may help but it also is not a perfect fix to a problem of people running.
The only fix is to stop and take responsibility for your actions and/or crimes.

 
Replies to highlighted areas in your post.
 
Like every high speed pursuit (or even slow) follow him until he screws up, runs out of gas or runs on foot or even do a PIT maneuver from behind (will explain below). Just like every pursuit I have seen.
 
Why was the officer in his lane? playing chicken. He had no right to head straight for him like that. I don't recall watching any high speed pursuit where cops keep swerving towards the runner, I always see them behind them. Even on the freeway they pull in behind them after merging onto the freeway to get into the pursuit.
 
As for the PIT at 100mph? please show me where police have (with permission from sarg)pitted someone at that speed,Oh yeah while searching for that video see if you can find one where the approved PIT maneuver is completed head on.
 
Here is a copy of the policy for PIT maneuvers.
 
The PIT is not applicable in every situation. Typical police policy is not to attempt the PIT at greater than 35 miles per hour (55 kilometers per hour). Its effective use requires careful choice of location, considering all possible effects on other traffic and pedestrians. Because of the police department's potential liability for the injury or death not only of the occupants of the target vehicle but also bystanders, most departments limit its use to only the most high-risk scenarios. Most departments specify that the PIT should only be used to stop pursuits that are immediately dangerous and ongoing. When possible, three pursuers should be present when a PIT is executed: one as the PIT vehicle and two following at a greater distance to react to the results.
The PIT is especially hazardous when the vehicles' bumpers are of significantly different heights, or against target vehicles with a high center of gravity such as vans or SUVs.
 
Well if my frien

RCR you do bring up some good points but a few to counter. 

Like every high speed pursuit (or even slow) follow him until he screws up, runs out of gas or runs on foot or even do a PIT maneuver from behind (will explain below). Just like every pursuit I have seen.                           This is sometimes easier said then done.   Many pursuits end well but how many pursuits have you seen end in tragedy?  Many of these if the officers pit-ed or put their own lives in risk in a head on manuver, instead of waiting for the mistake, the out come may have been different.  The only ones to be hurt may be the suspect and the officer who knows his/her job is sometimes to jeoperdize their own life for the safety of others.

Why was the officer in his lane? playing chicken. He had no right to head straight for him like that.                this I may agree with if the pursuit was traffic related only, like for a wheelie or something.  But if for a felony criminal  charge then maybe it was the right thing to do.this is why I would like to know more.

As for the PIT at 100mph? please show me where police have (with permission from sarg)pitted someone at that speed,Oh yeah while searching for that video see if you can find one where the approved PIT maneuver is completed head on.           An intentional 100 + mph pit may be hard to find but I'm sure there is video of contact at these speeds that had pit like results.  And while it would be hard to search for this particular example, I'm sure I could fine you may that if an officer would have put their vehicle in the way at slower speeds the tragic accident that ended it would have been avoided.

I agree with no one ride my motorcycle also, but we all have friends that let others ride.  What if you friend loaned theirs to a friend and they ran? 

The last two paragraphs I agree with you totally.  Maybe this video may influence one member of this forum, who read this thread, not to run if they put themselves in this type of predicament.  Even though some may see this as negative towards law enforcement, may be the positive would be that one person who saw this video thought about running but decided that it was not worth their own life if the cop made a mistake.

There is no fix.  Criminals will always run and we will always chase them.





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and thats why I wouldnt run....it can only end badly...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUneG1s1GP0 

^^^ My bad kike's video show's how well it works. Did you see the rider sitting there with his legs crossed all comfy and was being waited on by all those people, talking to him, holding his head, asking him how his day was going so far.

Thats the way some countries deal will motorcycles and cars racing and driving recklessly.  There is actually a longer video of this and that cop is lucky that he did not get himself killed by the mob.
That video, to me, shows an excessive and un-necessary way to stop a speeding motorcycle for only possibly a speeding violation.
Until you put in the situation of stopping a fleeing suspect, its always easier to critique a short video that only shows one chosen point.  Videos are great but a lot of these sites post certain segments or edit the video to show what they want.
Months ago my while I was in FTO ( Field Training Offcier) school, we were showed a video. To sum it up a chase ended with a suspect fleeing on foot.  One officers dash cam showed the suspect fleeing and looking back or something to that extent.  Then gunfire from the officers erupt and the suspect goes down.  The class started talking about this and when asked about my opinion I stated that I wanted to know more about why the cops shot first.  Well we were then showed a second angle from a second dash cam of a back up officers cruiser that showed when the suspect turned to look back he actually pointed a gun at the cops.  This gun was not visiable from the first dash cam, but  was totally visiable from the second.  I'll try to find this video.
Back to the original video of this thread, I am not saying that in this particular incident that a second dash cam would prove anything.  Some times video only shows one point of view and sometimes that point of view can be taken many different ways.  This point of view may help a cop look innocent when infact he is wrong, or may make a cop look wrong when infact he is right.  What I'm saying is that videos are not always what they seem. 

We wonder why cops have bad reps....????
 
cops can not do this type of thing. they need the higher ground all the time, even if it means letting the guy go. (maybe,,,, we dont know why he was running.)
 
This vid could have some gray area though... Im not sure that the cop really did want to hit the bike or if he got a little closer then he wanted to and didnt correct out of the way of the motorcyclist.
 
btw, not having your MC endorsment doesnt make you a squid. jesus christ. could we throw that word around more please? lol
 
 
 
 

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chad4000

We wonder why cops have bad reps....????

 
I don't.  Their profession is one where they have been given permission, from us (figureatively), to restrict our freedoms in pursuit of answers.
 
Show me a single profession where your job includes taking away freedom of movement, however long or short, and I'll show you controversy.
 
It's no secret why cops are hated.  Their job is a hated one, people want to be able to do what they want and get pissed when they can't.  And furthermore, we have forums for looky-loo onlookers to post biased clips that fuel outrage and breed animosity.
 
It's really no secret
 
P.S.  Thanks for the MC endorsement backup   I'll get it one of these days but hell, I don't keep bikes long enough to have one to test on.  Okay, bad example.  The F3 sits waiting...

quote:

ORIGINAL: KidCr3nshaw

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chad4000

We wonder why cops have bad reps....????

I don't.  Their profession is one where they have been given permission, from us (figureatively), to restrict our freedoms in pursuit of answers.

Show me a single profession where your job includes taking away freedom of movement, however long or short, and I'll show you controversy.

It's no secret why cops are hated.  Their job is a hated one, people want to be able to do what they want and get pissed when they can't.  And furthermore, we have forums for looky-loo onlookers to post biased clips that fuel outrage and breed animosity.

It's really no secret

P.S.  Thanks for the MC endorsement backup   I'll get it one of these days but hell, I don't keep bikes long enough to have one to test on.  Okay, bad example.  The F3 sits waiting...

 
 
I just think its more the way that they do it half the time. We dont really have the freedom to run from cops so they are not taking anything away. Its just that they run you over with their car vs stopping you and throwing the book at cha. Or the cop that pushed the bike over... it doesnt need to happen that way, yet it does, giving everybody that dislikes cops all the ammo they need.
 
I dont fundamentally hate cops, but they sure make it hard to defend them....

F'ker shouldnt have been running. One stupid thing leads to another. If you rob a bank and get shot in the process no one would be like that messed up he got shot robbing that bank. Same thing here, break the law and risk gettin broken! Just My Opinion.

thats bvllsh!t  ive had 2 friends die in the last year and the accidents looked pretty much the same as that.   i dont know bout anywhere else in the country but they cant do that kinda thing here.  no spike strips and deffinitly no pulling infront of a bike. that cop should be tazed in the nuts!!.  Running or not, mary jane or not.  i dont care. thats not right

^^^So it's never warranted huh?
 
What about this old clip... ?
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yoUaH6wGLs
 
Let's not be fools and make sweeping generalizations again, we've done great thus far and I can see that the last few comments may be headed in the wrong direction.
 
I've got no problem with people voicing their opinions, I just ask you educate yourself before making definite comments when you clearly are basing your opinions off of emotion rather than logic.
 
Clearly this is a scenario that will have unique resolutions for every unique situation.  WE DONT KNOW ALL THE FACTS so anything we say will be speculation.  But I would hope we wouldn't jump to conclusions, either in the officers defense or against him.
 
Maybe we don't need a female president...

quote:

ORIGINAL: KidCr3nshaw

^^^So it's never warranted huh?

What about this old clip... ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yoUaH6wGLs

Let's not be fools and make sweeping generalizations again, we've done great thus far and I can see that the last few comments may be headed in the wrong direction.

I've got no problem with people voicing their opinions, I just ask you educate yourself before making definite comments when you clearly are basing your opinions off of emotion rather than logic.

Clearly this is a scenario that will have unique resolutions for every unique situation.  WE DONT KNOW ALL THE FACTS so anything we say will be speculation.  But I would hope we wouldn't jump to conclusions, either in the officers defense or against him.

Maybe we don't need a female president...

 
 

Here is the clips that I spoke about before watch part one first then part two.

part one
http://youtube.com/watch?v=n7At5RyV_yo

part two
http://youtube.com/watch?v=lPEiRQoALcs

This just shows that video only shows one view.  I hope the links work, they look funny for some reason.  We should not sterotype all cops.  I bet most here that sterotype cops are the same that get upset when others sterotpye all sport bike riders as reckless and ignorant riders, etc.  You get my point.