Battery Dead?
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Battery Dead? - 7/26/2006 1:06:40 AM
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JIrvin
Posts: 2
Joined: 7/10/2006
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Ok here is my dilema, I have an 01' 929 and the battery randomly is dead. It happened a month ago and again today, both after approx. 100 mile freeway trips. I tested the stator and it seems to be charging, looked for loose or corroded wires. Any help would be greatly appreciated! Oh and my clock never holds time, it always resets when i turn the bike off even when the battery isnt dead if that is poss. part of the problem?
Thanks in advance, Justin
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/11/2006 11:09:26 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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Justin,
First I must apologize that I am not posting a solution for you or even a troubleshooting suggestion.
I have a similar problem with a '00 929. I have owned her since new and she never holds much of a charge in the battery. I am on my third one now - although, I am beginning to believe that I did not need to get a replacement this the most recent time since the new one exhibits the same behavior. I have a PCIIIr, LP flush-mounts (w/out the running lights) up front and Bikemaster short signals on the back (both pull slightly less voltage than stock). I have checked and rechecked the wiring (especially the ground\earthing connections) and I cannot find anything obviously wrong. I even keep her hooked up to a Battery Tender and she still fails to start about 30% of the time. I examined the starter switch (where Honda does this nifty trick of cutting power to the headlight when the start button is pressed) to see if it was corroded or melted - it was fine - on the suggestion from another forum. Mine will start and run fine on some days and on others the problem pops up with no apparent reason - 200 miles, 20 miles or 2 miles makes no difference. Temperature is also ruled out since this has all been during warm months. My clock holds time unless I keep trying to start her and drain the amps significantly. I have yet to take the dreaded trip to a shop for them to attempt to sort it and I really wish to avoid all the 'shop time' that will take.
Are there others out there that have experienced this? It would be nice if someone had experience or suggestions for troubleshooting. Anything is better than silence...
Thank you in advance,
Chris
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/12/2006 1:10:31 AM
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im4u2nv81
Posts: 66
Joined: 9/8/2006
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my clock wont hold time either
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/12/2006 12:33:00 PM
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sixs929
Posts: 322
Joined: 1/3/2006
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First - get the Haynes manual, it has a wealth of information and I believe it's easier to follow for non-mechanics than the shop manual (although I have both books ).
Second - I can only tell you that mine was acting in a similar fashion, and in my case (with the help of the Haynes book) I traced the problem to the stator. All's well after replacing the stator.
Third - I installed a voltmeter on my bike after the stator dropped me on the road, and I notice this bike won't crank with less than 11.5 volts showing on the battery. These bikes seem to be far less tolerant of a slightly low battery than a car is. 929's require a healthy charging system and a good battery to keep rockin'.
Hope you make out OK.
PS - I've already beaten this to death in other posts, but here's where I got the voltmeter, if you're interested - http://www.casporttouring.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=14124&Category_Code=Electronics
< Message edited by sixs929 -- 9/12/2006 12:34:15 PM >
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/12/2006 4:02:52 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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OK, I picked up the voltmeter (nice device, actually) and I will use it to see if I get dips in performance form the charging system. As it is, I see no problems with my stator - I used the shop manual and a handheld multimeter for testing it - and I have some experience with electrical gremlins from my MV. So, this device may help me figure out if it is an intermittent issue, I hope.
I suppose that I should ask if your problem was a regular issue or if yours would also work 70% and fail 30%? Did it start out that way or did your bike just not start at all?
Thank you,
Chris
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/13/2006 12:07:48 AM
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sixs929
Posts: 322
Joined: 1/3/2006
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I believe looking back that my problem was there from the time I bought the bike, but I rode it infrequently and just around town in the beginning - so I blamed the weak battery on not enough use of the bike. It dropped me on the road during my first long ride - the charging system couldn't keep up with the lights and fuel pump, the display finally went dead and shortly after the pump quit.
In my case, one leg of the three phases of the stator had opened and went dead, and the other two phases had to do all the work until they overheated and finally shorted to ground.
If you tested the stator, meaning looking for each of the three phases in tolerance as far as resistance, and none of them grounded, then the regulator could be the next suspect, and even a bad battery is a possibility.
The voltmeter will help you a lot in troubleshooting this. Be advised that the meter I told you about updates every few seconds, so if you rev the engine you won't see an immediate reaction from the meter.
And wouldn't you know it - after I've been telling everyone about this stupid thing, today mine lost its temperature readout! I only bought it for the voltmeter, so it's no big deal, it's just ironic.
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/13/2006 5:34:38 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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I did not have the same problems that you did in the beginning, but mine were similar. I rode often once I first picked her up, but that was late in the summer due to the early recall on the maodel for the fuel line. When winter came around I had to travel a great deal for work and I lived in Colorado, so days for riding were limited. When she would sit for more than a week I knew that I had to charge the battery. Some other owners told me that this was normal with the 929, so I ignored it. As long as I rode her at least twice a week she was fine...no problems. But, I moved to Hong Kong for a while and had to leave her behind (due to the cost of importing her there because they require all stock parts...long story). When I got back I found that the friend to which I had entrusted her for keeping her running had some serious family issues (sick parents, hospital stays, surgery, etc.) and could not keep up. So, of course, the battery was gone. I replaced it with a stock one and moved to where I am now in Oregon. (Oregon sucks - rains all winter and parts of spring and fall) So, she might sit for weeks without being touched; again, travel and bad weather. Then I bought another street machine and I was spending time riding her to get into the break-in and because I wanted to...But, I kept riding the CBR weekly, when I could, and bought a Battery Tender. This is really when I noticed the regularity of the failure. So, I did buy a new battery and the problem did not go away.
OK, enough of the 'book of my life'. I did look at the regulator - as well as the entire charging and electrical system - and I cannot find a definite failure area at all. Everything is in great shape and is connected well - no tears in insulation, no melted bits, full and complete contact all the way.
Thank you for the information about the updating of the system. I plan on keeping careful notes, even pulling over during a ride to write this stuff down, so that I can try to find a pattern which will lead to a solution. I plan on racing her, so this is could become more important later - though, she has yet to die while I was riding her; that has never happened. But, I figure that if there is an electrical issue somewhere it will eventually cause ignition issues and fouled plugs - but those are in good shape as of a few weeks ago.
Sorry that your voltmeter thing had a temp failure...I hope it works long enough for me to find this problem before I end up dropping her in a shop.
Thank you for all of your help! Hopefully others will benefit from our dialog!
Peace,
Chris
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/14/2006 8:34:56 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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sixs929,
Quick question for you about the voltmeter that you have on your CBR. Where did you hook up the orange wire on yours? It says that it should be hooked up to something powered by the ignition and there are several possibilities, so I thought I would get a suggestion from you before I finish this up.
OK, one more, where did you mount yours? I am thinking of a few good places near the instrument panel, but you have had experience with riding with yours already installed an I figure that you have a better idea of what looks, functions and performs better.
Thank you in advance,
Chris
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/15/2006 12:09:43 AM
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weeble1
Posts: 256
Joined: 4/20/2006
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I had the same problem on my bike but it did end up being the stator. One thing you might want to check is the Rectifier Regulator also.
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/15/2006 10:34:24 AM
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sixs929
Posts: 322
Joined: 1/3/2006
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Hey quixotic_1 -
I don't have my manual here at work, but if you have the manual, you can locate the "always hot" and "ignition-on hot" wires easily. Both sources are located directly below the ignition switch in its wiring bundle.
I mounted my meter directly below the existing instrument cluster on a plastic bracket I made, which stradles the existing two lugs on the base of the cluster. I'll see if I can find the pix I posted some time ago.
Six
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/15/2006 5:33:51 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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OK, very good! I was wondering if you had hooked it up to the ignition directly or if you had connected it to a secondary circuit (lighting, etc.). Since you have experience with using it on your bike I figured that you would know best where to locate it as well. I was considering placing it on top of and slightly behind the cluster - that way it would be more protected from getting wet. If yours is surviving well underneath it, though, that might be better for keeping an eye on it.
Thank you very much for the help (especially the photo) and the suggestions! I will update this post as soon as I have figured this out.
Also, thanks to weeble1 for the suggestion. I believe that I have checked that on a previous test session (they last for a while). I need to consult my notes, which are not with me at the moment.
I can't tell you how much I love electrical problems!
Thank you,
Chris
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/15/2006 7:15:38 PM
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sixs929
Posts: 322
Joined: 1/3/2006
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Yeah electrical issues usually will talk to you if you listen, and once you're armed with the elec. prints, you're on your way. ( I'm assuming you're serious about loving elec. problems......)
The only issue I have with the location I chose is that, as you can see, the clutch cable is a little in the way. Your location would be better for keeping it out of the elements, so its a toss up, I guess.
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RE: Battery Dead? - 9/16/2006 1:48:00 PM
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quixotic_1
Posts: 7
Joined: 7/31/2006
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Sorrow,
That sounds similar to my issue in some ways. Mine is unpredictable, so I have purchased the voltmeter as suggested by sixs929 to watch for this condition (and others). Since there is no ryhme or reason to my problem, all I can do now is monitor it and then track down a culprit. Thank you for the suggestion!
sixs929,
After looking at the instrument cluster extensively last night, I determined that your placement may be the best available. I tried to put it in the top area (as I described), but there is too little space there for it to fit solidly. Yes, more protection but, no way to see the guage except from the front of the bike...I sure hope that this helps to solve this mystery! Oh, and I was being sarcastic when I mentioned 'electrical problems' - I hate them. I have had a 4Runner, Accord, Tacoma, Suzuki GSXR, CBR929 and a MV Agusta with electrical issues; I solved all but three of those (4Runner, CBR and MV - which is in the shop now since it is under warranty and the problem has been traced to a CDI unit that is known to fail), and it always took longer than I expected! So, electrical issues are sort of a theme with me and I do not want to see any more of them...they can be fun to track down - but they also take much time - and I would rather be riding my CBR than working on her while it is still dry here in Oregon...
Thank you and I will report my solution if I find it!
Chris
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