Your Preference? Throttle or brake?

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Your Preference? Throttle or brake?

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Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/28/2007 2:55:24 AM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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So, I've been working on my wheelies for some time now. Started with sit-downs, and have now moved on to stand-ups. (Staggered)

I clutch mine up from maybe 10mph. I'm geared -1 +5, so I run out of gear in first pretty quick if I don't get it up there fast, which is what got me working with my brake.

Now when I clutch a stand-up, I almost immediately grab the rear brake to catch / control the wheelie. By the time I get to about 30mph the bike gets nice and stable, and from there my throttle hand barely moves at all, and I just keep the wheelie controlled with the rear brake... by trying to go just past the balance point.

My longest first gear wheelie was just under 400 yards / or about a 1/4 mile. I run out of gear at about 65mph, and I have to put it back down before I hit the limiter for a smoother landing.

But for the moments that I hear my revs slow down, and sometimes just stay there, it's heaven lol. I'd be happy to ride them at about 45 forever.

Anyways, my question... especially for you first gear people. Do you keep the balance point with the throttle or the brake?

I imagine that people who can ride the balance point in first gear until they get bored use the brake... and those that have to put them down because of running out of gear use the throttle.

Ok, so yeah.

Thanks

- Pixel -

Ooh, and one last bit while i'm thinking about it... I've noticed that if i'm going even slightly up-hill, I tend to hold the wheelie much better and with way less acceleration. Anyone else get that? It seems like the balance point feels lower. Anyways...

- Pixel -

< Message edited by pixel 6 -- 5/28/2007 4:31:47 AM >

Post #: 1

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/28/2007 4:15:20 AM

Dirtytoes

Posts: 278
Joined: 3/16/2007
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i use throttle. my rear brake control is shit.

knowing how to use the rear brake wheen wheeling is REALLY good!

...tho you should never completely rely on ur rear brake....u also shouldn't always use it to keep wheelies where u want em....if u use em to much, itll get hot and won't be there to save ur ass when u loop.

(in reply to pixel 6)

Post #: 2

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/28/2007 4:50:09 AM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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Yeah, I don't like drag on my rear brake or anything like that... but I tend to launch my wheelies alot higher now that i know how much brake it takes to slow the wheelie down...

So it' s basically from slow start:
Nice and strait, little extra weight on my left rear peg (I'm breaking the habit of launcing ever so slightly to the right)... easy acceleration, and launch. I try to bring it to the balance point as smooth and as fast as possible... so clutching it up high is the only way to go, and I don't gain much speed by the time it's way up there.
I then press / tap the back brake once it gets way up there, and hold my throttle position close to where I can balance it. Then I just add the throttle on a bit, maybe a slight bit more throttle... oops too much... light press on the brake, release, etc.

The ones I avoid now are the too low of launch, and then you have to give it way too much throttle to power it up the rest of the way. I'd rather over launch it, and use the brake to hmm... for lack of better descriptions "catch it".

Ak. All this talking about doing wheelies is killing me lol. 2:45am. I need to find myself a better weekday spot, and put in a session tomorrow.

- Pixel -

(in reply to Dirtytoes)

Post #: 3

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/28/2007 9:32:19 AM

JZHALES

Posts: 1569
Joined: 7/30/2006
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youre in the same boat as me, i can launch straight to 12 but when u launch it that high u have to use brake which i suck at doin, so from now on im gonna launch a lil lower and probably end up gaining some speed steadily till i learn the brake

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my bike has character

(in reply to pixel 6)

Post #: 4

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/28/2007 10:04:59 AM

Err

Posts: 824
Joined: 4/8/2006
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lear the rear brake. it will save you.

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don't be a hater kid

(in reply to JZHALES)

Post #: 5

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/29/2007 12:54:47 AM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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Man, what a day.

Put in a session today. Started really thinking about control and the balance point.

I made progress in launching them straighter by putting more weight on my back leg during the launch. Also took some time while up there to make sure that I'm not dragging on the brake. I noticed that I do actually do that sometimes, and made some mental adjustments.

I was watching some guy who was doing highway wheelies on the way to the spot (I don't do highway stuff), and observed that his body posture was horrendous! I used my observations with him to really take a look at my posture. Even tho I'm staggered stance, it's literally straight up and down. I also noticed that if I "force" my body position to be straight up and down right after the launch, I get the bike stable much quicker.

Now for the juice...

Being that I put in sessions quite often, I know how far I normally carry a wheelie before coming up to the limiter... so the distance is usually in the same ballpark give or take like 50 feet.

Put one up today, and it was perfect from the launch. The speed stayed real low and the bike was super stable, posture was perfect. So i'm going down the road... and going... and going... and going! Because of my consentration on technique, I added about 200 feet to my wheelie! That puts my longest first gear wheelie to about 1600 feet. just shy of 1/3rd mile. I think a few more sessions like today, and I'll truely be at the balance point, and there will be no difference between 1/3rd mile and 5 mile wheelies.

Well, there ya go.

=)

Keep em up, keep em straight, and keep your bike in one piece to do em the next day!

- Pixel -

< Message edited by pixel 6 -- 6/1/2007 3:27:51 AM >

(in reply to Err)

Post #: 6

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/29/2007 4:29:33 AM

1 UP

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Joined: 8/5/2006
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i got a question i got sit downs down pretty well now. is it real hard to do the staggered stand up?? do you guys clutch it up while off the seat or still sitting then stand up with the bike comin up?????

(in reply to pixel 6)

Post #: 7

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/29/2007 5:26:10 AM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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Staggered vs just standing on front pegs... well, this is the idea... stand with your feet shoulder width apart... and have somebody push you backwards... what do you need to do to keep from falling over? (move a foot back)

Standing staggered to begin with, it helps give you front to back balance that you lose if you keep both feet on the front pegs. I would say that it is a bit akward to learn at first, as it is not as natural compared to regular riding position. But the advantage of staggered outways the other once you near the balance point. Especially if you don't have the rear brake under control.

I have seen people do the sitdown, clutch it... then stand method. But one thing I've come to learn, is that doing big motions with the body tends to upset the bike and throttle control. Therefor I prefer to stand up. move my left foot back to the rear peg, and then clutch it up.

Same idea goes here for bouncing.... tweaks your body out of position a bit, and makes for some interisting launches.

Last bit I can offer would be this... feel that foward tug when you clutch a sitdown too low? And rather than the bike coming up smooth, you get lurched forward instead? Same thing with standups.

As hard as it is to learn the technique smoothly due to the change in body position and no longer being "locked" in with the bike.. It helps immensly with the feel of launching a standup if you bring the bike up a good ways the second you clutch it, rather than lurching forward with a low launch. Make sence?

Keeping the knees bent and touching the tank when first learing em helps too.

- Pixel -

< Message edited by pixel 6 -- 6/1/2007 3:50:05 AM >

(in reply to 1 UP)

Post #: 8

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 5/30/2007 5:01:34 AM

Dirtytoes

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Joined: 3/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: 1 UP

i got a question i got sit downs down pretty well now. is it real hard to do the staggered stand up?? do you guys clutch it up while off the seat or still sitting then stand up with the bike comin up?????

i also started out with sitdowns....to the point where i had em on lock.

took me 3 days to get staggered on lock.

once you can do sitdowns...staggered comes easy.

p.s. get in position, then launch....iow....standup, then clutch....not at the same time.

(in reply to 1 UP)

Post #: 9

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/1/2007 3:27:09 AM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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Today went well. Went to the normal spot and worked on the stand-ups. And, well lol, I need a longer road. Carried them a few times from beginning of the road, to the end. (About 1800ft.) What a great day.

Felt the bike try to loop on me 3 times as I pushed the limits of the balance point, and simply pressed rear brake to bring it back and get the wheelie stable again.

The most notable one, I never went faster than say 40mph for the whole road. Just kept it balanced, and at the same speed for the entire strip!

Only problem lol, is I still need to get that mile marker under my belt, so I need to find a longer strip of road.

But I will say, that today is hands down the first time that I have ridden a controlled wheelie at the balance point... compared to having just gotten to that point before.

Changed my chain and sprocket today as well, so a bit of psychological grease helped me out there too. The bike seemed to launch with little effort (kept the same gearing) and was much more responsive.

I used the same link count on the chain, and even tho I kept the sprocket sizes the same, My axle moved forward about an inch lol. How's that for chain stretch?

Only wierd by-product, is that I can now clutch sit-down 2nd gear wheelies and pull em up nice and high, which I couldn't do before. Not sure how a new chain and sprocket of the same teeth effected that, but I'll take it. Was laughing all day.

Well there ya go. My friend is going to video me in the next few days, and I'll put em up on youtube for you guys to see.

I still say Brake as my preference!

- Pixel -

(in reply to Dirtytoes)

Post #: 10

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/2/2007 11:03:12 PM

transamlt1man

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It is all throttle control... the brake is just for extreme measures..

(in reply to pixel 6)

Post #: 11

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/2/2007 11:15:52 PM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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Well, I've always known that my clutch lever sucks. You need to have the power of the increadable hulk to pull the thing in with 2 fingers. (Don't make the clutch angry... you wouldn't like the clutch when it's angry!) So last night I met up with a bunch of well to do and highly talented stunters, and noticed that all of them were using the MSR Pro Raptor clutch lever... and on their bikes it's all buttery and super easy to pull in.

So went down to the local shop today and picked myself up one... the shorty 2 finger version.

WOW what a difference. It took me about an hour to get it absolutely adjusted for how I like the clutch to engage-disengage, but it's super sweet. It makes it really easy for me to pull in the clutch now.

It's raining now, so didn't get a chance to put in a session, but I'll keep ya posted on what I think of it then. So far tho, LOVE IT!

- Pixel -

(in reply to transamlt1man)

Post #: 12

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/4/2007 4:37:17 AM

Dirtytoes

Posts: 278
Joined: 3/16/2007
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lol, 1800ft is plenty....our spot is only about 100ft

(in reply to pixel 6)

Post #: 13

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/4/2007 10:42:25 AM

stuntn_r6

Posts: 375
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quote:

ORIGINAL: transamlt1man

It is all throttle control... the brake is just for extreme measures..

dont listen to this guy.. The brake is what you use to control your wheelie to be smooth. Just using throttle makes for unstable, choppy wheelies.

(in reply to transamlt1man)

Post #: 14

RE: Your Preference? Throttle or brake? - 6/4/2007 7:02:52 PM

pixel 6

Posts: 157
Joined: 10/2/2006
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So this week's been a good learning experience. The clutch lever is absolutely wicked. After putting in a half day session getting used to the lever, I managed to do the 1800 ft. length of the road again. So since I had a bit of enery left, I gave 2nd gear a bit of practice.

For whatever reason, I was only using 1 finger to clutch it up in 2nd, and it seemed to come up no prob (with a tiny bounce as I launch it). So went back into first for a bit, and got used to 1 finger clutching there as well. Seems that with more fingers on the bars, I tend to bring it up straighter.

So re-learing 13 years of riding, and switching to 1 on the clutch.

Probably a good idea tho, as in the near future I plan on adding a hand brake. So getting this down now, should help me learn the finger brake without having too many old habits in play.

And ooh yeah... 2nd is flippin fast! (not used to that yet... kind of like the slower stuff better lol)

- Pixel -

(in reply to stuntn_r6)

Post #: 15