RE: dropping your helmet
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/13/2007 1:11:00 PM
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halik008
Posts: 259
Joined: 8/21/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lrn2Go
quote:
ORIGINAL: halik008
A. The shell absorbs minimal energy, it's there purely to stop object protrusion. Majority of the energy is absorbed my the foam.
B. Look up the SNELL spec if you believe helmets are designed to only withstand one hit.
C. You are sucker for marketing. :P
Hey man, it's your head, your life. You can rock that "safe or not" line all you want. I'm no sucker for marketing, I'm a sucker for "better safe than sorry". And... to prove we're BOTH right, I copy this directly from SNELL's website....
dropped my helmet! Do I have to go buy a new one?Generally the answer is probably not. (Score a point for Halik008) Helmets are one use items (Score a point for me), but are quite durable otherwise, at least the ones we certify. Frequent dropping or spiking a helmet on the ground, or other hard surfaces may eventually degrade the helmet's performance (Depending on how you read that, could be a point for either one of us). Similarly if the helmet falls to the ground at highway speeds unoccupied the owner must be aware that some degradation may have occurred. In general the real damage comes when the helmet contacts an object with a head inside (Point for Halik008). The Foundation recommends that if you are participating in an activity that requires that you wear a helmet, that you avoid hitting stuff with your head. It can be difficult to readily determine if a helmet has been damaged, and the protective capabilities compromised without a thorough inspection by a trained professional (Score a point for Me). Some manufacturers may provide this service or direct you to these others that can perform these inspections. The Foundation recommends that if you suspect your helmet may be compromised, then replace it (Point for Me again). If the helmet has been involved in an impact while in use, replace it. (Point for Halik008)So there you have it... make your choice and take your head in your own hands... haha!
"Helmets are one use items (Score a point for me)"
....the hardest Snell test for a motorcycle helmet to meet—is a two-strike test onto a hemispherical chunk of stainless steel about the size of an orange. The first hit is at an energy of 150 joules, which translates to dropping a 5-kilo weight about 10 feet—an extremely high-energy impact. The next h it, on the same spot, is set at 110 joules, or about an 8-foot drop. To pass, the helmet is not allowed to transmit more than 300 Gs to the headform in either hit.
http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/gearbox/motorcycle_helmet_review/
^^Look foam is not dead after the 1st impact. No points for you :P
"It can be difficult to readily determine if a helmet has been damaged, and the protective capabilities compromised without a thorough inspection by a trained professional (Score a point for Me)"
^^^ they say it's uncertain if the helmet is damaged if it falls @ highway speeds not a stationary drop. so i don't see how that is "point for you"
"The Foundation recommends that if you suspect your helmet may be compromised, then replace it (Point for Me again)"
^^ lol i don't see how them saying "do whatever you want" is "a point for you" hahahaha
< Message edited by halik008 -- 9/13/2007 1:13:19 PM >
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/13/2007 6:06:25 PM
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Lrn2Go
Posts: 1331
Joined: 8/2/2007
From: Oklahoma City
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: halik008
"Helmets are one use items (Score a point for me)"
....the hardest Snell test for a motorcycle helmet to meet—is a two-strike test onto a hemispherical chunk of stainless steel about the size of an orange. The first hit is at an energy of 150 joules, which translates to dropping a 5-kilo weight about 10 feet—an extremely high-energy impact. The next h it, on the same spot, is set at 110 joules, or about an 8-foot drop. To pass, the helmet is not allowed to transmit more than 300 Gs to the headform in either hit.
http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/gearbox/motorcycle_helmet_review/
^^Look foam is not dead after the 1st impact. No points for you :P
"It can be difficult to readily determine if a helmet has been damaged, and the protective capabilities compromised without a thorough inspection by a trained professional (Score a point for Me)"
^^^ they say it's uncertain if the helmet is damaged if it falls @ highway speeds not a stationary drop. so i don't see how that is "point for you"
"The Foundation recommends that if you suspect your helmet may be compromised, then replace it (Point for Me again)"
^^ lol i don't see how them saying "do whatever you want" is "a point for you" hahahaha
Don't you just LOVE opinion arguments? I know I do.  So, let's pick apart your sentences again...
1. So, in a test, they strike a helmet two times? This doesn't mean that the foam DIDN'T collapse the first hit... and, the second hit isn't as hard as the first. If you take this to a "real life" situation, it's simulating an impact (your head on the road for example), and then a followup bounce (in the SAME wreck, say, when your tumbling along afterwards). I would still call this a "One Use" situation. And... the article you linked me, did you even read the whole thing? Dr. Jim Newman, an actual rocket scientist and "highly respected head impact expert" said this about SNELL's test you just described... " "Over the last 30 years," continues Newman, "we've come to the realization that people falling off motorcycles hardly ever, ever hit their head in the same place twice. So we have helmets that are designed to withstand two hits at the same site. But in doing so, we have severely, severely compromised their ability to take one hit and absorb energy properly. " Maybe an argument can be made about a "drop" situation, but that leads into the next comments... (by the way, everyone SHOULD read that link he posted... excelent read!)
2. You took two different points and mashed them together. Yes, is says "If the helmet falls to the ground at highway speeds unoccupied the owner must be aware that some degradation may have occurred", but that's not what you called me out on. You quote my "point" three sentences later. That is a STAND ALONE point. "It can be difficult to readily determine if a helmet has been damaged, and the protective capabilities compromised without a thorough inspection by a trained professional". Aka, it's DIFFICULT to DETERMINE, to the non-professional, if a helmet's protective capabilities have been effected. If you or I are professional helmet inspectors, then I give up and retract everything I've said up to this point.
3. This point is mine because it's entirely based on the probability that you think your helmet COULD be damaged. Since we're both NOT professionals, then my "damaged" point will be different than your "damaged" point. If the manufacturer, the designers and engineers, of a company state that, from a drop of 4 feet or more it should be at least tested, if not out-right replaced. With that in mind, then when something occurs outside this stated precautionary limit, I then "suspect" that my helmet "May" be compromised. You're right, it's up to me if
< Message edited by Lrn2Go -- 9/13/2007 6:20:25 PM >
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/13/2007 6:08:24 PM
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TheX
Posts: 2311
Joined: 12/17/2006
From: Austin TEXAS
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I always figured it had to be good for more than one impact.....some crashes involved quite a few bounces.
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/13/2007 7:50:21 PM
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Lrn2Go
Posts: 1331
Joined: 8/2/2007
From: Oklahoma City
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"The Foundation recommends that if you are participating in an activity that requires that you wear a helmet, that you avoid hitting stuff with your head." Haha. Different helmets for different things. You can wear a football helmet while rollerblading, but I wouldn't wear a bicycle helmet to play football.  So... who wants ice cream!
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/13/2007 9:19:03 PM
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Lrn2Go
Posts: 1331
Joined: 8/2/2007
From: Oklahoma City
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 Oh man... I give up. You see the WIERDEST **** in any given bit of text. Yeah sure, football helmets are the best helmets in the world. Speaking of, it's time for me to go grate my balls on an old washing board. 
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/15/2007 10:35:47 PM
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black_98civic
Posts: 140
Joined: 9/6/2007
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my brothers hit me in the back of the head while i was wearing my helmet with their hands somewhat hard but nothing major but its been done a few times as i never knew this about helmets. should it be replaced?
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/16/2007 12:23:24 AM
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Justice06RR
Posts: 46
Joined: 9/15/2007
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i say its still good if its just a minor 'drop'. since i'm poor and just have one helmet for now, i've dropped my helmet while riding at about 15mph (it was clipped in the rear seat since i was only around the neighborhood). i'm positive its still good altho its got scratches.
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RE: dropping your helmet - 9/18/2007 2:31:02 AM
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NeverL8
Posts: 441
Joined: 9/12/2007
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guys depending on the angle it drops it could be done, just like a egg dropping on a carpet. like the one time you mentioned that padding came out, all the padding comes out. also so you can wash or replace. but then you can see if any part is more swollen than any other areas. i think you can figure out the rest. and if you still decide to use it, try not to crash on that part of your helmet. ride safe.
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