RE: awareness on the track
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/14/2008 3:10:58 AM
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camaro_forums
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quote:
ORIGINAL: idodirt
Each track is different. Usually, if they've got a web site (most all do) there will be a page that lists what things need to be done to your bike before you can take it on the track. In my mind I was imagining something like what you see at actual races. You know, several guys with clipboards walking around your vehicle closely inspecting every inch. It didn't exactly happen that way. Jennings listed the requirements, and you're expected to meet them. They didn't exactly have someone come around and look the bike over. There were certainly plenty of track personell around, so they could have been give the bikes a quick look as you came out of the pits, but I couldn't tell. Now, if the track is rented to some organization like a club or school, then they will have their own requirements, which will more than likely be more stringent. It all depends. For Jennings GP there were minimal requirements. Tape up all the glass, tape or remove turn signals, remove the license plate. Tape up rear lights (I removed the bulbs and taped). Zip tie the rear pegs in the up position or remove them. No antifreeze in your cooling system, I'm using water and a product called Water Wetter. No oil leaks on the bike. Other than that, I was good to go. I didn't have to "wire up" anything like the drain plug, or the oil filter. Hope this helps.
Awesome info!!! Thanks a bunch, helps give me an idea of what needs to be done in easy terms.
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 07 Blue/Silver 600RR
Mods: Carbon front fender, 03-06 integrated taillight, Hotbodies flush mount signals, CF "Honda Racing" tank protector... Shoguns in the mail!
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/14/2008 4:52:14 AM
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krash
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well you can wait on the jury for your insurance to pay for a bike you tore up on the track. I know it aint happening unles you have one of the very, very few insurance companies that will still cover it. and then you got wait and see how much your rates will go up for the next several years.
I'm not saying every-one is going to wad up a bike, or that you push it ball's out until you go down. but fact of the matter is someone is going home with scratched plastics from every single track day, and sometimes they have to bring the bike home in parts. Have you ever been to a track day where nobody went down at all? I mean part of the deal is that the track is a learning experience, and learn what your limits are, so that you can ride within those limits on the street. you are there to increase your skills, and explore your limits of traction and skill in a safe environment.
when people are expanding their skills, at some point, they find the limit, and sometimes go a little past it.
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07 600 RR track weapon
''''''''''''''''01 white/red F4i SOLD
PCIII
Akrapovic Ti slip on
Galfer SS line
Ohlins forks springs
Woodcraft rearsets
Hot Bodies flush signals
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/14/2008 5:22:29 AM
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snowboarding82
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Oh dear no I don't expect insurance to pay for a bike I crashed at a track. I wouldn't tell them I did it I would just pay for the parts out of pocket. I think I'll start my own insurance company. $2-300 for a day of full coverage at a track with a $500 deductable. Total a $10k bike? Get a new one and your regular rates dont go up!
Mike
< Message edited by snowboarding82 -- 5/14/2008 5:32:30 AM >
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'06 F4i, Blue Galfer SS lines, K&N air filter, Blue/black, Pazzo short levers, Sportech chrome double bubble, windscreen, Hotbodies front flushmounts, Rumble undertail, Blue "Pimp Stripes"
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/14/2008 5:38:33 AM
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Jaybird180
Posts: 2341
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There's a thread around where the insurance thing is being debated, as most people will say that rider training is covered. My last couple weekends were in fact classes. But enough about me.
Keith Code talks about finding limits and suggests that there is a better way to finding the limit than going over it and crashing. Is is just sales talk, or does he really have a teaching method? I dunno.
From personal experience, I've had a trackday where I rode very well. Well enough that I was forced to change habitual things that I didn't even know I was doing....little stuff like the fact that I cock my right hand and elbow outboard. That's because I was at my personal limit for that habit and when I began to go faster, it became a barrier. The elbow kept coming back out but the desire to maintain what I'd felt in previous corners brought it back in. An instructor didn't tell me that, the bike and my personal limits did.
That same day, I experienced suspension tuning problems and front end push on entry (first time it happened). When I happened I instictively knew what had happened. I didn't need an expert to tell me tha the front had pushed. I was at the limit, but never exceeded it. When the problem was cured, I could then go past that limit safely.
I think the bike communicates, and when the rider/bike combination is ready to do something it will speak. Code calls it confidence. I just stroke my bike and say, "talk to me baby" LOL.
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TrackDay Ready 02' F4i
ZG Double Bubble, Galfer SS Lines, PCIIIr, Muzzy s/o, NRC cover, Shift Minder(anyone want it?), Speedbleeders, Vortex sliders, fender elimated, GP Shift
Ohlins, Racetech, Showa Custom Suspension
Teaching Fun and Prosperity
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/29/2008 12:20:09 PM
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rk97
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quote:
ORIGINAL: krash
In the novice class, the speed is fairly slow, and everyone is learning at the same time so there is no major aggresiveness.
I have to disagree with this to some extent.
First of all, all track-day organizations are different. I have ridden with NESBA, Sportbiketracktime, and Fasttrax (in their 'track rider school,' not a track day) - all have different rules, and different structures to the way they teach.
STT runs a very structured novice program. Structured does not mean slow for everyone. I ran plenty fast with STT - but I do prefer NESBA's structure now that i'm not so green to the track.
NESBA's beginner group is fast. scary-fast for someone new to the track. I wish I'd done STT first. beginner is a relative term, only! I promise you there are "B" riders with NESBA who can out-pace "I" riders with STT - STT lets you sign up for whatever level you want. NESBA will not allow you to move up until you've proven you're capable.
I did a school with Fasttrax - again, they let you run as fast as you're safely capable. You have to be 'speed certified' to run their track days (which means you completed their track school and demonstrated that you're reasonably safe, and fast enough to keep pace)
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/29/2008 12:51:50 PM
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krash
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thats a good point, and I may not have been clear, but I was thinking about the STT novice when I made that statement. also, fwiw, some of the STT novice guys can really get around a track. I seem to run mid pack in I with STT, but I almost consider signing up for N sometimes just to see.
_____________________________
07 600 RR track weapon
''''''''''''''''01 white/red F4i SOLD
PCIII
Akrapovic Ti slip on
Galfer SS line
Ohlins forks springs
Woodcraft rearsets
Hot Bodies flush signals
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/29/2008 2:37:58 PM
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rk97
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the only way i will sign up for N again with STT is if the track is totally new to me.
if i did a full weekend, I'd do one day in N and one in I.
the classroom stuff two days in a row is just boring. If you catch on the first time, there's no point in doing it twice.
But i talked to people who have done "N" 10 times with STT. either they have no desire to go faster, or they just don't get it - but at least they KNOW they don't get it and aren't signing up for I group. I applaud them for that.
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RE: awareness on the track - 5/30/2008 9:05:22 AM
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Jaybird180
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How could a class with a human instructor EVER be the same??? (It's a rhetorical question, don't answer)
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Ohlins, Racetech, Showa Custom Suspension
Teaching Fun and Prosperity
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RE: awareness on the track - 6/3/2008 7:17:03 AM
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rk97
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lol - true. I think even racers would pick up SOMETHING from a day in the classroom. Just a new way of thinking of things, or another perspective they hadn't considered before.
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RE: awareness on the track - 6/3/2008 11:32:25 AM
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Jaybird180
Posts: 2341
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My last school would have been a waste had it not been that I'd picked up a new definition:
Apex- The point where you begin to pickup the bike
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TrackDay Ready 02' F4i
ZG Double Bubble, Galfer SS Lines, PCIIIr, Muzzy s/o, NRC cover, Shift Minder(anyone want it?), Speedbleeders, Vortex sliders, fender elimated, GP Shift
Ohlins, Racetech, Showa Custom Suspension
Teaching Fun and Prosperity
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RE: awareness on the track - 6/3/2008 1:23:37 PM
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krash
Posts: 1187
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hell, at this point, I dont even remember what the point of this thread was, but I feel like leaving an update.
We just did a another trackday with STT at Mid-Ohio. It is a different division of STT than the southern division, and it really shows in the novice groups. The I and A group structure was the same. but the same girl that did novice at Barber did Novice at MO. And she was not happy. some of it was her own situation though. she was too fast for the newest novice division, but not fast enough to keep up with the "expereinced" novice group.
the differences were that in the southern division:
half day of class -after lunch no classs
passing is allowed within certain limits
and no speed limits, go as fast as your comfortable after lunch
north easter division:
all day class
no passing at all unless in a group and led by an instructor
instructor set the pace. she basically did 60mph parade laps all day.
again, if she felt more confident she should have moved up to the experienced novice, so you cant blame STT, I am just pointing out the differences.'
apex: the point at which everything on the bike is laying on the ground and you suddenly become accutely aware at what the vast amount of difference between 10,000 and 10,200 rpm is while simultanously thinking Ohhhhh sh!!!!t, I think my tires are sliding 
_____________________________
07 600 RR track weapon
''''''''''''''''01 white/red F4i SOLD
PCIII
Akrapovic Ti slip on
Galfer SS line
Ohlins forks springs
Woodcraft rearsets
Hot Bodies flush signals
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RE: awareness on the track - 6/3/2008 2:29:17 PM
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Jaybird180
Posts: 2341
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quote:
ORIGINAL: krash
hell, at this point, I dont even remember what the point of this thread was, but I feel like leaving an update.
Does it even matter?
quote:
ORIGINAL: krash
We just did a another trackday with STT at Mid-Ohio. It is a different division of STT than the southern division, and it really shows in the novice groups. The I and A group structure was the same. but the same girl that did novice at Barber did Novice at MO. And she was not happy. some of it was her own situation though. she was too fast for the newest novice division, but not fast enough to keep up with the "expereinced" novice group.
the differences were that in the southern division:
half day of class -after lunch no classs
passing is allowed within certain limits
and no speed limits, go as fast as your comfortable after lunch
north easter division:
all day class
no passing at all unless in a group and led by an instructor
instructor set the pace. she basically did 60mph parade laps all day.
again, if she felt more confident she should have moved up to the experienced novice, so you cant blame STT, I am just pointing out the differences.'
60 MPH laps...What a joke. I wouldn't be happy either. My grandmother can do 60
_____________________________
TrackDay Ready 02' F4i
ZG Double Bubble, Galfer SS Lines, PCIIIr, Muzzy s/o, NRC cover, Shift Minder(anyone want it?), Speedbleeders, Vortex sliders, fender elimated, GP Shift
Ohlins, Racetech, Showa Custom Suspension
Teaching Fun and Prosperity
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